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Atheists and Agnostics Meeting Place

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Robotculator said:
Huwaw, very well said, you enriched me.

1. Agnostics, it was defined that existence of God cannot be proved but they really exist and also uncertain in telling which God. It is how I define it, with the supervision of my Philo profs.

3. btw, I am strongly sure that God do not exist. I already proved it dozen of times in some forums and symposiums.
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sa 1. Siguro po mejo Atheist din Profs mo sa Philo kaya na-impluwencyahan kana rin plus sa surroundings and experienced mo din cguro bossing. In my case naman, 100% Theist Profs ko sa Philo kasi sa Diocesan Seminary ako nag aral at natoto ng AB Philo :excited: .PERO, I'm still searching for the truth pa rin hanggang ngayon. Kasi naman, hindi purket isinilang tayong Catholico o Christiano eh hindi na tayo pwde magtanong sa relihiyon, kumbaga Faith and Reason.

sa 3. Pano po? baka po pwde mo eshare kung bakit ganyan pananaw mo at kung pano mo naproved?
 
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renmazuo274 said:
What part of "I do not have an answer" do you not understand? If I do not have an answer, then surely I do not have the perfect answer now, do I?

You also are referring to an event that happened more than 7 or 8 years ago. Do you expect a normal person without hyperthymesia to recall the entire details of a 2-hour ordeal? Even trying to recall what the details of your conversation with the barber last year is almost impossible, unless you make stuff up.

Tell you what, if you want to, we can recreate the scenario here, I'll ask questions as I would an OIC. You answer however you like, but keep your cool, cut the bull***t, and STAY ON TOPIC, otherwise we will not move on (I can't stress this enough). Your advantage here is, you have google, and you do not have to answer to spontaneous questions (an OIC should be able to, given it is their one and only resource). How's that?

As for the tax part, challenge accepted. You have a penchant for asking the impossible, and you seem to have done your research for you to say that, so I'd like to ask you the basics first: Can you provide me a proof that I can work with? If not, how did you arrive to such a conclusion? I based mine around the fact that religion prefers to be tax-free, and in this country, they mostly are (which is stupid and hypocritical for christians, since it defies the book's words of giving what is due for caesar and for the guy's father up in the sky. Apir, tax-paying people here). Where do you base yours?

If you would think long and hard, it is illegal for the BIR to disclose sensitive information such as taxpayer info without court orders, right? So how did you get your facts?

I did see an abante and sunstar newspaper before about tax evasion cases (among other, more disturbing things) against your sect, particularly the one wherein your sect failed to pay property taxes for 2006-2007 in Apalit. But seeing as the main defense is that the INC is behind all the allegations, which, given the political nature of the INC, could be feasible, I'd rather stay away from those "biased" sources and go straight to the actual source. Though also biased, I'm compelled to get the all side of the stories, and you seem to know a lot. So please, enlighten us.
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Well then, ok you don't have an answer, but again asking is different from questioning, I don't know if your getting that point. now are you too old to forget even a single question you have to that OIC??? It's s two hour ordeal as you described it right? and your experience it unforgettable one , but sadly you didn't recall any of your question...??? How sad naman... So let's just forget about it na lang... ;)

Now about TAXES.

Well for you to know the truth about TAXES, you should ask from the sources, which is the BIR, but if you really think that's impossible then I can do nothing about it...
Now how could our sect be charged of TAX Evasion, If Religious Groups are exempted from TAXES??? Isn't Ironic?? As you can see INC is the one always prosecuting our group even dragging issues to the court of men, inventing cases and charges against our group and our leaders, so I'm not surprise if they are behind that tax Evasion charges, That how they work... See the ministers that are now against the counsel?? See how charges are filed against them?? So don't be surprise by their tactics... ;)

How do you think all of you here will be enlightened, If this is the THREAD is for Agnostics and Atheist??? I think that is impossible since all of you here have your "Preconceived" Ideas right?? Reading the reply form other members here, I don't think that is possible, I don't have the capacity to enlighten you, unless God will do it, so do you really think there is a chance?? If there is, why do you think so??? ;)
 
det2x said:
Well then, ok you don't have an answer, but again asking is different from questioning, I don't know if your getting that point. now are you too old to forget even a single question you have to that OIC??? It's s two hour ordeal as you described it right? and your experience it unforgettable one , but sadly you didn't recall any of your question...??? How sad naman... So let's just forget about it na lang... ;)

Now about TAXES.

Well for you to know the truth about TAXES, you should ask from the sources, which is the BIR, but if you really think that's impossible then I can do nothing about it...
Now how could our sect be charged of TAX Evasion, If Religious Groups are exempted from TAXES??? Isn't Ironic?? As you can see INC is the one always prosecuting our group even dragging issues to the court of men, inventing cases and charges against our group and our leaders, so I'm not surprise if they are behind that tax Evasion charges, That how they work... See the ministers that are now against the counsel?? See how charges are filed against them?? So don't be surprise by their tactics... ;)

How do you think all of you here will be enlightened, If this is the THREAD is for Agnostics and Atheist??? I think that is impossible since all of you here have your "Preconceived" Ideas right?? Reading the reply form other members here, I don't think that is possible, I don't have the capacity to enlighten you, unless God will do it, so do you really think there is a chance?? If there is, why do you think so??? ;)
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Now, now, I still remember the initial question I asked, of course. I always start at "before we start, can we go first to your belief's basics?". If the preacher says yes (which they will do), I will ask "you will base your answers on your bible, so I would like to start there if that's ok". Surely enough, they will still say yes. Next question is the initial question "do you think that book alone is a valid resource for us to use today, if so, why?". Now religions all have their own answer, which, sadly, for your sect or the OIC's answer, I don't remember anymore. But they all have one thing in common: they will give you a generic answer. I believe your OIC said "for we believe it is the word of God" but I can't be certain since as far as I can remember, The INC, RC, methodist, and some other christian sect had this answer. One thing is for certain, they have different ways of defending it. Questioning is the term, since I found chinks in their answer that need to be questioned.

Now generic answers always have holes in them, which we focus on. Different sects, different answers, different chinks in the answer we tackle. If you are someone who talked to INC, RC, ADD, baptists, Methodists, Mormons (these are persistent, but pleasant bunch), muslims, and even aglipayans, you will forget all their answers within 7-8 years. I know for a fact that their answers were not satisfactory, but I have a lot better uses for my memory than memorizing their answers.

*gasp* Didn't you know? Though religion is technically tax-free in terms of income (much to the regular taxpayer's dismay), there are some exceptions to the rule. If you did your research on taxation, you'll find that real property taxes still need to be paid by churches if used for some other purposes other than charity, education and religion (please refer to section 28(3) of our phil constitution). I believe there are some buildings under your sect's name that functioned beyond that (hospitals, maybe, or non-profit but non-charity school? I believe you have these). Even the Phil arena had to pay property taxes. Remember, the tax evasion case was only for 2006-2007, and I specified earlier that it is for property tax, not income tax (which, you apparently did not know/bother to research).

Earlier, you claim that your church pays taxes. I asked for proof or something I could go on to dismiss the tax evasion case. Di mo maprovide, since pati sa yo di mo ma-prove. E san galing yung claim mo na nagbabayad kayo ng taxes? Most of us here probably knows that religions need to pay some taxes, but the way you put it seems to point out that you pay taxes unlike most sects, meaning you pay more taxes than most. Di mo maprove yung claim mo.

Now, you claim that religions are tax-free para lang depensahan ang tax evasion case nyo, neglecting to see the exceptions.

...Bakit bigla ka ata bumaligtad?

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frian said:
sa 1. Siguro po mejo Atheist din Profs mo sa Philo kaya na-impluwencyahan kana rin plus sa surroundings and experienced mo din cguro bossing. In my case naman, 100% Theist Profs ko sa Philo kasi sa Diocesan Seminary ako nag aral at natoto ng AB Philo :excited: .PERO, I'm still searching for the truth pa rin hanggang ngayon. Kasi naman, hindi purket isinilang tayong Catholico o Christiano eh hindi na tayo pwde magtanong sa relihiyon, kumbaga Faith and Reason.

sa 3. Pano po? baka po pwde mo eshare kung bakit ganyan pananaw mo at kung pano mo naproved?
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Robotcalculator is no longer active. I've been here a long time, di ko na siya naabutan.
 
rueryuzaki said:
Of course, I'm after with the cars... Imma good boy.
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"CAR SHOW" :rofl:":buddy:

@Frian

you can ask questions here na lang, since TS was missing for a long long long time... hindi ko na din naabutan sya.
 
frian said:
ah ok...:D
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Yep. You can ask questions. We'd be glad to answer. As you can see, we are pretty nice people if mature and intelligent ang usapan. Give or take may mga jokes (-ish) na posts like yung usapan ng 2 (ingget ako... gusto ko sumama kaso strictly monitored ako and ala akong time), pero maayos naman kami kausap. Do not expect one answer from one person to reflect the viewpoints of the regulars here entirely though, since magkakaiba din kami ng belief dito.
 
^wala na akong maitatanong bossing..c ts sana gusto kong tanungin eh pero inactive na pala cya..hindi namn pwdeng ikaw tatanungin ko kasi viewpoint ni ts ang gusto kong malaman kung bakit ganun nasabi nya (doon sa statement nyang i quoted) at sabi mo na nga bossing magkakaiba kayo dito ng belief so I better not ask nalang if ts isn't here.
 
renmazuo274 said:
Now, now, I still remember the initial question I asked, of course. I always start at "before we start, can we go first to your belief's basics?". If the preacher says yes (which they will do), I will ask "you will base your answers on your bible, so I would like to start there if that's ok". Surely enough, they will still say yes. Next question is the initial question "do you think that book alone is a valid resource for us to use today, if so, why?". Now religions all have their own answer, which, sadly, for your sect or the OIC's answer, I don't remember anymore. But they all have one thing in common: they will give you a generic answer. I believe your OIC said "for we believe it is the word of God" but I can't be certain since as far as I can remember, The INC, RC, methodist, and some other christian sect had this answer. One thing is for certain, they have different ways of defending it. Questioning is the term, since I found chinks in their answer that need to be questioned.

Now generic answers always have holes in them, which we focus on. Different sects, different answers, different chinks in the answer we tackle. If you are someone who talked to INC, RC, ADD, baptists, Methodists, Mormons (these are persistent, but pleasant bunch), muslims, and even aglipayans, you will forget all their answers within 7-8 years. I know for a fact that their answers were not satisfactory, but I have a lot better uses for my memory than memorizing their answers.

*gasp* Didn't you know? Though religion is technically tax-free in terms of income (much to the regular taxpayer's dismay), there are some exceptions to the rule. If you did your research on taxation, you'll find that real property taxes still need to be paid by churches if used for some other purposes other than charity, education and religion (please refer to section 28(3) of our phil constitution). I believe there are some buildings under your sect's name that functioned beyond that (hospitals, maybe, or non-profit but non-charity school? I believe you have these). Even the Phil arena had to pay property taxes. Remember, the tax evasion case was only for 2006-2007, and I specified earlier that it is for property tax, not income tax (which, you apparently did not know/bother to research).

Earlier, you claim that your church pays taxes. I asked for proof or something I could go on to dismiss the tax evasion case. Di mo maprovide, since pati sa yo di mo ma-prove. E san galing yung claim mo na nagbabayad kayo ng taxes? Most of us here probably knows that religions need to pay some taxes, but the way you put it seems to point out that you pay taxes unlike most sects, meaning you pay more taxes than most. Di mo maprove yung claim mo.

Now, you claim that religions are tax-free para lang depensahan ang tax evasion case nyo, neglecting to see the exceptions.

...Bakit bigla ka ata bumaligtad?
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Panong bumaliktad??? Eh It's just about that news article you read in abante and sunstar that I gave comment to. I don't even know whether that news is true or not?? Ni hindi ko nga alam kelan mo nabasa yun, so what happened to the case if that was true??? Sorry sir if I lack knowledge in taxation law ha, I'm not a lawyer so hindi siguro ako makakasabay sa nalalaman mo pag dating sa batas ukol sa taxation... Maybe the basics lang po siguro, Now if your saying sa real property tax po, yun po ba ang amilyar right??? So if you are not correctly or completely not paying it are you already liable of tax evasion??? Ano sanction ng gobyerno or BIR dito??? So what happened kaya sa case if there was really charges filed???

May nabasa lang po ako... eto po ba ang sinasabi mo???

EXEMPTION OF RELIGIOUS, CHARITABLE AND EDUCATIONAL ENTITIES, NON-PROFIT CEMETERIES AND CHURCHES FROM PROPERTY TAXATION
Prohibition against taxation of real property actually, directly and exclusively used for religious, charitable and educational purposes
Charitable institutions, churches and parsonages or convents appurtenant thereto, mosques, non-profit cemeteries, and all lands, buildings, and improvements, actually, directly, and exclusively used for religious, charitable, or educational purposes shall be exempt from taxation. [Section 28 (3) , Article VI, Constitution]

Now if your asking san, galing yung claim ko para sabihin kong nagbabayad ang Church namin ng taxes??? Galing yan sa Administration namin, na dapat sana nga daw ay exempted na but dahil sa paniniwala namin sa Bible na kagaya ng pinaniniwalaan mo somehow na give to caesar what is due to caesar, that is why our Church pay taxes, well kaya nga if you want to validate why not go directly to BIR para malaman mo if totoo nga or hindi diba??? Para concrete ang proof mo for yourself... do I have to present my proof to you??? If you are willing to know what is true you can find evidences not only for me but also sa mas valid na source since validity naman ang hanap mo right??? but if you saying na " If you would think long and hard, it is illegal for the BIR to disclose sensitive information such as taxpayer info without court orders, right?" tapos ako pa hahanapan mo nun? Sino naman ako diba? ;)

Hindi naman sa dinidipensahan ko yung tax evasion case kung meron man sir, I'm just giving you reason why would it push thru sa court if meron man pero since sabi mo na in relation sa real property taxes kamo and it is not included sa tax exemption ng mga religious group, That I don't know... I told you limited knowledge ko about it... So panong bumabaliktad dun??? ;)

Going back to your unforgettable but not so experience with that OIC, so see sabi ko naman sa'yo maaalala at maaalala mo rin yan sir, I don't think your too old for that. ;)
But reading out your question and making comment about the answer to b generic? It is but natural since Bible is our basis of our faith... Pero I doubt if you will ask that question to Brother Eli maybe you might hear branded answer to that question. ;)

So you are not satisfied with the OIC's answer??? Why??? What is that you are looking for, if you don't have your "preconceived idea" about it? Since you don't want to tagged it as an answer... ;)

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ronell10 said:
"CAR SHOW" :rofl:":buddy:

@Frian

you can ask questions here na lang, since TS was missing for a long long long time... hindi ko na din naabutan sya.
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Ano sir nasa langit na ba si TS o nasa baba??? ;)
 
@det

aba'y di ko po alam, may nakapunta na ba sa taas or baba?
 
May nabasa ako, pero as usual fairy tale lang naman yun sa inyo, so ewan ko kay TS kung nasaan na siya??? Siya na lang makakapagsabi if totoo nga yun kung nasan man siya ngaun... hehehe ;)
 
@stormer, et al
Yung Carshow ni Mika Umali I thought dito sa Manila... Sa cebu pala -_-
 
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rueryuzaki said:
@stormer, et al
Yung Carshow ni Mika Umali I thought dito sa Manila... Sa cebu pala -_-
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Huh, and now we have a name!!??

This is getting interesting... :lol:

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I searched...yesssss, she's hottttt!!!!!!!!!!

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On another note...I have been following events in the Mideast about our beloved terrorists wreaking havoc on historical grounds, and lately they've managed to level down a 2000-year old ancient temple in Syria. Methinks a parallel universe with the terrorists all tied up with the sacred structures and going ka-boom with them would be sweet justice, words are not enough how ignominious this one act is. A few more years and our offsprings would be staring at a flattened section of Earth with only historical footnotes to give cursory information about what had been there in the past....
 
Stormer0628 said:
I searched...yesssss, she's hottttt!!!!!!!!!!
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One sweet hot mom sya, FYI. :lol:


Stormer0628 said:
On another note...I have been following events in the Mideast about our beloved terrorists wreaking havoc on historical grounds, and lately they've managed to level down a 2000-year old ancient temple in Syria. Methinks a parallel universe with the terrorists all tied up with the sacred structures and going ka-boom with them would be sweet justice, words are not enough how ignominious this one act is. A few more years and our offsprings would be staring at a flattened section of Earth with only historical footnotes to give cursory information about what had been there in the past....
Click to expand...

I feel sad when I hear or see this kind of news. Sayang yung mga artificats.
---
On the other side of Morality Issues.... This may spark up your day.

 
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