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Totoo Nga Bang Dyos si Hesus?

Wag mo na paikutin ang point at logic. Nagbibigay ka lang ng maling storya sa nagbabasa ng thread na ito. Tanggapin mo na lang na si Jesus ay may authority na katulad ng sa Ama, at hindi sya basta nagkatawang "tao"". Again unawain mong mabuti ang patungkol dyan sa pagbubuntis ni Maria, sinabi ko na diba basahin mo at unawain ang storya about kay Angel Gabriel at Maria. Pinaiikot mo lang ang kwento na wala namang pupuntahan. It doesnt even point sa katotohanan. Puro ka daw at sabi ng iba. Wag mo nang gawing reference yung sabi ng iba, ibigay mo ang best opinion mo about sa topic.

Salamat! ^_~

Ano mali storya ang itinutukoy ko? Hindi ko maunawaan ang sinasabi mo.

Hindi ko sinasabi LESS THAN si Hesus at wala AUTHORIDAD na katulad ng Ama.

Nauunawaan ko ang tinutukoy mo na PAGBUBUNTIS ni Maria, sina ANGEL GABRIEL... lahat. So clear na siya.

Ang sinasabi mo naman sa akin na "PURO KA DAW" at "SABI NG IBA" ay mga tao na naniniwala na si HESUS ay galing sa SINAPUPUNAN ng AMA.

Ang question ay ito. "Bakit mini mention ng mga tao (ang iba tao lang naman) na si HESUS AY NANGGALING SA SINAPUPUNAN NG AMA? Ang english ng AMA ay FATHER. GENDERLESS ang AMA or FATHER or GOD THE FATHER pero ang CHARACTERISTIC ay MASCULINE.

E ang SINAPUPUNAN ay exclusive for FEMALE lang or sabihin natin *it is for feminine* ... Bakit minimention ng mga iba tao na naniniwala kay God na keyso nanggaling si HESUS sa SINAPUPUNAN NG AMA? Anak siya ng Ama.

Sabihin natin na tama na anak ni Ama si HESUS at siyempre, anak ni Maria si HESUS din. Meron role naman din si Maria diba?

Anyway............. never mind.

If gusto ng mga tao na NANGGALING SA WOMB NI GOD THE FATHER SI HESUS ay ayos lang naman. Beliefs nila iyan. Gusto nila pero ang sa akin lang naman ay para kase AWKWARD ang resulta kapag sinasabi na...

" Si Hesus ay anak ng Ama. Galing sa SINAPUPUNAN ng Ama "

Mas okay pa kapag sinabi na...

" Si Hesus ay anak ng INA. Galing sa SINAPUPUNAN ni Maria " pero hindi naman pwede sa ilan tao ata iyon sapagkat sa buo BUHAY NG MGA TAO dito sa earth at sa buo sanlibutan, GINAWA LANG NAMAN OBJECT si Maria at hindi naman siya itinuturing DIETY or GODDESS or IMPORTANT ROLE ng mga tao ( GODDESS ay opposite ng GOD. Feminine kase siya so, imbis God ay Goddess ) ... kaya siguro, people always believe na " SI HESUS AY NANGGALING SA SINAPUPUNAN NG AMA " kahit napaka obvious ang mismo MERON LANG SINAPUPUNAN AY SI MARIA. Siya ang nagluwal sa GOD THE SON diba? Then imagine, wala na siya role dahil object lang siya ni God the Father dahil ang meron sinapupunan lang ay si Maria.

Sana huwag magalit. WOMEN are the only one who give birth at meron SINAPUPUNAN. Sila lang ang meron nun so I also understand why noon una panahon na kahit meron Gods at Goddesses during past history, still ang meron important role ay ang mga Goddesses or Goddess.

Nagkaroon ng spiritual evolution at nagkaroon ng monotheist from past to present days and now, Goddess(es) ay hindi na nag eexist.

Less important na siya na kahit sa society natin na kung ano concept ng God natin in the present day ay reflect kung papaano magbehave ang mga tao sa kapwa tao.

Ngayon, I am not an ATHEIST okay?

But it seems na if ganyan nga talaga ang kabuuan ng STORYA ay meaning to say na parang sinabi na less than nga ang babae realistically dahil nga remember? Everyone knows men are superior in society and women are consider the weaker vessel.

Si Maria ay simbolo ng kababaehan ay lalo kinakailangan stay pure to a 1st husband. Virgin Mary ang tawag diba?

Si Maria nga ay anak niya si Hesus at galing sa sinapupunan nito but yet, wala siya credit sa pagluwal nito sa anak na si Hesus dahil people still believe na si God the Father ay nanggaling si HESUS sa sinapupunan nito.
 
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Mga ka Mobi, share ko lng po aq po ay isang Iglesia ni Cristo at proud po aq dun, ang paniniwala po namin ay si Jesus Christ ay "Tao" sapagkat sya na rin po mismo ang ngsalita ayon sa banal n kasulatan o "Bible" sapahayag naman po na tao ang gumawa ng Bible ay totoo po un ngunit nakasulat dn sa Bible na ginabayan sila ng Panginoong Diyos "Ang AMA" upang hindi sila mgkamali, sapamamagitan po ng mga Apostol. Kung gusto nyo magsuri maari po kayong magtanong sa mga kaanib o mga ministro ng Iglesia ni Cristo para malinawagan po kau, lahat po ng tanong ninyo ay sasagutin nila at lahat ng sagot ay manggagaling lamang sa banal na kasulatan o Bible.


salamat mga ka Mobi.
 
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I do believed that Jesus is God. As who claimed to be a Christian, one must believe that the Bible is the word of God and the final authority of what we believe in. But if not, then why argue. This kinda, lengthy explanation but is worth reading. This is my take.

Some say Jesus Christ was just a man, or maybe a great teacher. But He was and is much more than that. The Bible says Jesus is unique in both His person and His purpose. He wasn’t just some spiritual individual during His time on earth; He was both God’s Son (John 3:16) and God Himself—God in human flesh (1 Timothy 3:16) Yes, He was fully man, but He was also fully God (Colossians 2:9).


BIBLE_REFERENCE:SCRIPTURE:
John 3:16​
"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." KJV
1 Timothy 3:16​
"And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory." KJV
Colossians 2:9​
"For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form" NIV

THE CLAIMS
Jesus claimed to be God. It might be hard to understand how this could be true, but it’s important to remember that God is much bigger and more powerful than we can comprehend. We do know that Jesus said He existed before Abraham (John 8:58). He claimed that He and His Father are one (John 10:30), and that He is equal with the Father (John 5:17-18).

BIBLE_REFERENCE:SCRIPTURE:
John 8:58​
"Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I AM." KJV
John 10:30​
"I and my Father are one." KJV
John 5:17-18​
"In his defense Jesus said to them, “My Father is always at his work to this very day, and I too am working.” 18 For this reason they tried all the more to kill him; not only was he breaking the Sabbath, but he was even calling God his own Father, making himself equal with God." NIV

Not only did He claim to be God, but He also claimed to have the power of God. He said He has the authority to judge the nations (Matthew 25:31-46). He claims the authority to raise people from the dead (John 5:25-29) and to forgive sins (Mark 2:5-7)—things only God can do (I Samuel 2:6; Isaiah 43:25).

BIBLE_REFERENCE:SCRIPTURE:
Matthew 25:31-46​
31 “When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his glorious throne. 32 All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left.

34 “Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35 For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

37 “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

40 “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’

41 “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’

44 “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’

45 “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’

46 “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.” NIV
John 5:25-29​
25 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.

26 For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself;

27 And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man.

28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,

29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation. KJV
Mark 2:5-7​
5 When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralyzed man, “Son, your sins are forgiven.”

6 Now some teachers of the law were sitting there, thinking to themselves, 7 “Why does this fellow talk like that? He’s blaspheming! Who can forgive sins but God alone?” NIV
1 Samuel 2:6​
“The Lord brings death and makes alive;
he brings down to the grave and raises up. NIV
Isaiah 43:25​
“I, even I, am he who blots out
your transgressions, for my own sake,
and remembers your sins no more. NIV

Further, Jesus says He has the power to answer prayers (John 14:13-14), and that He will be with His followers always (Matthew 28:20). The New Testament equates Jesus to the creator of the universe (John 1:3), and in John 16:15, He says, “All that belongs to the Father is mine.”

BIBLE_REFERENCE:SCRIPTURE:
John 14:13-14​
13 And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14 You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it. NIV
Matthew 28:20​
Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen. KJV
John 1:1-3​
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning. 3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.

BUT WHERE'S THE PROOF?
Claiming to be something, as Jesus claimed to be God, doesn’t make it true. Where’s the evidence that He is God?
Jesus’ identity isn’t based solely on what He says, but on what He does. And He has left a lot of evidence that He is God. That evidence includes fulfilled prophecy and recorded miracles in which Jesus reversed the laws of nature. He also lived a sinless life (Hebrews 4:15), something no one else has done.


BIBLE_REFERENCE:SCRIPTURE:
Hebrews 4:15​
For we do not have a high priest who is unable to empathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are—yet he did not sin. NIV

The ultimate proof of His divinity, however, was His resurrection from the dead after His death on the cross. No one else has ever risen from the dead on his own.

DID JESUS SAY, 'I AM GOD'?
If someone said to you, “I am God,” would you believe him? Many people who believe in one God would think the person is blaspheming. Even if Jesus said the exact words, “I am God,” many people would not have believed Him or even heard what He had to say. Yet, He did give us reasons to believe such a claim without using these words.

In Luke 4:8, Jesus says, “It is written, ‘You shall worship the Lord your God and serve Him only.'” He said and showed many times that He is the Lord. Jesus says, for example, that He is “the first and the last” (Revelation 1:17, 22:13), which God the Father says in Isaiah 44:6.

BIBLE_REFERENCE:SCRIPTURE:
Revelation 1:17​
When I saw him, I fell at his feet as though dead. Then he placed his right hand on me and said: “Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last. NIV
Revelation 22:13​
I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End. NIV
Isaiah 44:6​
Thus saith the Lord the King of Israel, and his redeemer the Lord of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God. KJV

But maybe you’re looking for a place in the Bible where Jesus says, “I am God; worship me” in those exact words. If we suggest that Jesus could only claim to be God by saying that one sentence, we might also ask where He says, “I am a great teacher, but not God,” or, “I am just a prophet; don’t worship me.” The Bible doesn’t say that, either.

The good news is that Jesus told us He is God in many different ways! He has made it clear that He and God the Father are one (John 10:30), and says in John 14:6, “I am the way and the truth and the life.” Who else could claim these things except God?

DOES THAT MEAN THERE ARE MULTIPLE GODS?
Believing Jesus is God doesn’t mean there are multiple gods. Followers of Jesus believe in one God in three persons.
As Billy Graham once explained, “God has shown Himself to us in three ways—as Father, Son and Holy Spirit. Each has a separate function—and yet they are all united as one God.
“Let me illustrate it this way. Have you ever thought of some of the things we see around us that are both three—and yet also one? Centuries ago, St. Patrick used a clover leaf to teach the Irish about this—it has three leaves, and yet is still only one leaf. Or think of water. A quart of water can be ice, water, or steam—but it’s still the same quart of water.”


WHY SHOULD WE CARE WHO JESUS IS?
There is one way to heaven, one way to be free from your sin and to have a relationship with God. That’s through Jesus Christ. Acts 4:12 says, “Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to mankind by which we must be saved.” To have eternal life in heaven, you must put your trust in Jesus. Here’s why:

We all sin, meaning we all fall short of God’s perfect standard. The consequence of sin is death (Romans 6:23). That means eternal separation from God. But because Jesus lived a sinless life, His death on the cross provided the perfect sacrifice for our sins. Because He defeated death by rising again, we can have eternal life in the presence of God when we put our trust in Him.

BIBLE_REFERENCE:SCRIPTURE:
Romans 6:23​
For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord. NIV

Hundreds of people saw and believed in the risen Christ after His death and resurrection, and countless people in the past 2,000 years have discovered that only Jesus can meet the deepest longings and needs of the human heart. In Jesus Christ alone “are hidden all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge” (Colossians 2:3).

BIBLE_REFERENCE:SCRIPTURE:
Colossians 2:13​
When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins. NIV

WHERE IS JESUS RIGHT NOW?
Jesus is in the Right Hand of the Father in Heaven (Ephesians 1:17-21)

BIBLE_REFERENCE:SCRIPTURE:
Ephesians 1:17-21​
17 That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:

18 The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,

19 And what is the exceeding greatness of his power to us-ward who believe, according to the working of his mighty power,

20 Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places,

21 Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come:

22 And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,

23 Which is his body, the fulness of him that filleth all in all. KJV

CONCLUSION
One of the clearest teachings in Scripture is the Deity of Christ. Countless pages could be penned to expound upon the innumerable verses that express this teaching. One needs to be prepared to teach people about the Divine nature of Jesus, for it is necessary to understand in order to be saved. Jesus plainly taught in John 8:24 “Unless you believe that I am he, you will die in your sins”.

Jesus is God. Colossians 2:9 states: “For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily”. In fact, God even calls His own Son God in Hebrews 1:8 “But to the Son He says: ‘Your throne, O God, is forever and ever; A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your Kingdom’”. Jesus is fully Divine and we must worship and serve Him as such. To conclude in the same manner that John concluded his first epistle: “And we know that the Son of God has come and has given us an understanding, that we may know Him who is true; and we are in Him who is true, in His Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God and eternal life” (1 John 5:20).

What I am saying, does not attempt to "prove" that Christ is God because this truth requires faith. The purpose here is to help the Christian clarify his belief in our Lord and God and Saviour Jesus Christ; namely, that He is the Creator, and we are His creatures.


There are still many that I would like to share. It's up to us to evaluate ourselves that are we really in FAITH. God bless whoever read this. SHALOM.

P.S. When it comes about the Deity of Jesus Christ, it's not about what religion says, but what the Bible says.
 
@nefangit026

Siempre yun ang utos sa Kanya eh, magkatawang tao eh. Sa Lupa pantay sya katulad ng tao, maliban na sya ay isang sugo at may taglay na "kapangyarihan" na basbas ng Ama. Iyon ang inutos sa Kanya maging tao para maranasan nya yung sakit ng katulad ng nararamdaman ng isang tao sa lupa.

Ikaw ba pag ang pagkakakilanlan sayo ay isang "Diyos", baka sabihin ng ibang tao.. "hayaan mo lang yan "Diyos" yan eh, hindi makakaramdam ng sakit o paghihirap yan." See the difference? May dahilan kung bakit nagpakatao sya but technically He's part of our Father and the Holy Spirit.

John 1:1 + John 1:14
Sa dalawang verses na yan, ano sa palagay mo si Jesus?


"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."

The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the one and only Son, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.
 
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@nefangit026

Siempre yun ang utos sa Kanya eh, magkatawang tao eh. Sa Lupa pantay sya katulad ng tao, maliban na sya ay isang sugo at may taglay na "kapangyarihan" na basbas ng Ama. Iyon ang inutos sa Kanya maging tao para maranasan nya yung sakit ng katulad ng nararamdaman ng isang tao sa lupa.

Ikaw ba pag ang pagkakakilanlan sayo ay isang "Diyos", baka sabihin ng ibang tao.. "hayaan mo lang yan "Diyos" yan eh, hindi makakaramdam ng sakit o paghihirap yan." See the difference? May dahilan kung bakit nagpakatao sya but technically He's part of our Father and the Holy Spirit.

John 1:1 + John 1:14
Sa dalawang verses na yan, ano sa palagay mo si Jesus?


"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."

The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the one and only Son, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.



Tao po sya, ngunit ginawa syang tagapamagitan ng AMA, kaya kakaiba sya sa mga ordinaryong tao gaya ntin, malinaw po na pinakilala ni Jesus ang AMA na "only true God"

kung sa palagay mo Diyos din si Cristo lalabas po na dalawa sila? hindi tugma dun sa sinabi na "Only true God".

At ang katangian ng totoong Panginoong Diyos ay ispiritu lamang wala syang laman at buto gaya ng isang tao.

ito po panuorin nyo po paliwanag ng Iglesia ni Cristo

Link: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=xkorfEuz8bo
 
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John 1:1 + John 1:14
Sa dalawang verses na yan, ano sa palagay mo si Jesus?


"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."

The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the one and only Son, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.[/QUOTE]

sabi sa ibang salin like Goodspeed ng katulad na talata ay

In the beginning the Word existed. The Word was with God, and the Word was DIVINE.

14 So the Word became flesh and blood and lived for a while among us, abounding in blessing and truth, and we saw the honor God had given him, such honor as an only son receives from his father.

sa salin naman ni James Mofatt ay ganito


1 THE Logos existed in the very beginning, the Logos was with God, the Logos was DIVINE.

14 So the Logos became flesh and tarried among us; we have seen his glory — glory such as an only son enjoys from his father — seen it to be full of grace and reality.

Ipinahihiwatig lang na ang Salita/Verbo/Word/Logos ay BANAL or DIVINE sa URI at hindi sa KALAGAYAN.... kung tatanggapin natin na lahat ng DIVINE ay Dios sa kalagayan ay dapat tanggapin mo din na si David, Abraham at Noe pati na rin si Esteban ay Dios din sa kalagayan kasi sila ay tinawag na mga BANAL.
 
John 1:1 + John 1:14
Sa dalawang verses na yan, ano sa palagay mo si Jesus?


"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."

The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the one and only Son, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.

sabi sa ibang salin like Goodspeed ng katulad na talata ay

In the beginning the Word existed. The Word was with God, and the Word was DIVINE.

14 So the Word became flesh and blood and lived for a while among us, abounding in blessing and truth, and we saw the honor God had given him, such honor as an only son receives from his father.

sa salin naman ni James Mofatt ay ganito


1 THE Logos existed in the very beginning, the Logos was with God, the Logos was DIVINE.

14 So the Logos became flesh and tarried among us; we have seen his glory — glory such as an only son enjoys from his father — seen it to be full of grace and reality.

Ipinahihiwatig lang na ang Salita/Verbo/Word/Logos ay BANAL or DIVINE sa URI at hindi sa KALAGAYAN.... kung tatanggapin natin na lahat ng DIVINE ay Dios sa kalagayan ay dapat tanggapin mo din na si David, Abraham at Noe pati na rin si Esteban ay Dios din sa kalagayan kasi sila ay tinawag na mga BANAL.[/QUOTE]


Nope, wag mo guluhin ang iniikutan ng Trinity. We dont care about David and any... Dahil iyan ay likas na tao talaga.
Wag mo nang isalin pa sa ibang salin ang mga verses, nandyan na at malinaw, bakit doon pa sa malalim na salin mo ihuhugot lahat ng pagkakaiba nito? Sa ganyan bang paraan ba mo ginagawa para malinlang ang mga nagbabasa? Bakit pag malinaw sa verses na ayon sayo eh hindi na kailangan ng ibang salin?

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Tao po sya, ngunit ginawa syang tagapamagitan ng AMA, kaya kakaiba sya sa mga ordinaryong tao gaya ntin, malinaw po na pinakilala ni Jesus ang AMA na "only true God"

kung sa palagay mo Diyos din si Cristo lalabas po na dalawa sila? hindi tugma dun sa sinabi na "Only true God".

At ang katangian ng totoong Panginoong Diyos ay ispiritu lamang wala syang laman at buto gaya ng isang tao.

ito po panuorin nyo po paliwanag ng Iglesia ni Cristo

Link: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=xkorfEuz8bo

Hindi parin TAO lang.. Masasabi mo bang TAO lang si Jesus kung may espesyal na pagtatangi sa Kanya ang Ama? Hindi ko pinupush na isa Siyang Diyos ng kataastasan, ang punto ko eh hindi siya TAO mismo katulad ng TAO sa lupa. Sinabe ko na noong una pa, iyon ay MISYON ni Jesus sa Lupa. Di bat noong natupad na ang lahat ng utos nasabi ni Jesus na... John 19:30 ..Natupad na ang misyon nya sa Lupa.


Ilang beses ko ba dapat ulitin na kaya nagkatawang tao ang Jesus ay para maging pantay ang tingin ng taong lupa sa kanya at sa gayon ay maramdaman nya ang sakit nang kagayang sa tao ay nararanasan? Kung sakaling kilala siyang anak ng Diyos, sa tingin nyo ba magkakaroon ng malalim na pag simpatya ang mga tayo sa kanyang kahabagan? Hindi...

Malinaw na sinabi sa video na MAY TANGI si Jesus na hindi mo makikita sa tao. So ano ang mga tanging iyon? Kung iyon ay katulad ng sa Diyos, maaari kaya nating isiping isa rin siyang "Diyos" ? In the sense of sinsabe sa video na may katangian sya, dahil ang pagkakaalam ko iisa lang ang katangian ng isang normal na tao. At pakiberipika ng link na nashare mo, mukhang mababaw lang ang pagunawa mo sa sitwasyon ni Thomas sa mga panahong iyon, pati ang ministro eh mababaw nilang dinigest kung papaano nila ipinaliwanag ang sitwasyon.

Malinaw si Thomas ay naniniwala kay Jesus subalit hindi nawala ang kanyang paniniwala na si Jesus ay isang "Diyos" ayon sa sumunod na talata. Subalit NAIS NYA LAMANG MAKASIGURO NA SI JESUS NGA ANG NABUHAY MULI. Just imagine wala si THomas noong unang magpakita si Jesus, pero alam ni Jesus ang kanyang agam agam. Yan dapat ang itatak mo sa iyong isipin. HIndi yung pang ibabaw na sinasabe lamang.

Hindi importante ang ibang salin kapatid. Kung susuriin mo ang pagkaka buod ng sentence, malalaman mo ang buong saloobin ng nagkwewkento. Hindi mo kailangan ng sinasabing "na shock" or ano pa man... Hayyysss...
 
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Nope, wag mo guluhin ang iniikutan ng Trinity. We dont care about David and any... Dahil iyan ay likas na tao talaga.
Wag mo nang isalin pa sa ibang salin ang mga verses, nandyan na at malinaw, bakit doon pa sa malalim na salin mo ihuhugot lahat ng pagkakaiba nito? Sa ganyan bang paraan ba mo ginagawa para malinlang ang mga nagbabasa? Bakit pag malinaw sa verses na ayon sayo eh hindi na kailangan ng ibang salin?

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kapagka poh kasi nag STICK ka lang sa isang salin eh mahuhulog ka sa maling pagkaunawa ng nilalaman ng talata.. gaya na lamang ng nasa Juan 1:1 at 14 na pilit mo itinutulak na Dios nga si jesus sa likkas na kalagayan gayong ang IPINAHIHIWATIG pala ng talata ay INUURI lang ang Salita/verbo/Word/Logos na DIVINE/BANAL
kung gusto mo eh humanap ka din ng ibang saling ng I timoteo 2:5 , Juan 8:40 or Juan 17:1,3 na nagpapakilala na Dios si Jesus.. goodluck na lang kung meron man.
pag kasi tinanggap na Dios si Jesus sa Juan 1:1 at 14 eh lalabas na magiging magkasalungatang mga pahayag ni Apostol Juan.. kaya nga may sinabi si ernz na PAGWAWANGIS dahil sa kadamihan ng salin ay naiiba na ang mga pagkakaintindi ng mga nagbabasa lalo na kung mag sstick lang sa iisang salin..







Hindi parin TAO lang.. Masasabi mo bang TAO lang si Jesus kung may espesyal na pagtatangi sa Kanya ang Ama? Hindi ko pinupush na isa Siyang Diyos ng kataastasan, ang punto ko eh hindi siya TAO mismo katulad ng TAO sa lupa. Sinabe ko na noong una pa, iyon ay MISYON ni Jesus sa Lupa. Di bat noong natupad na ang lahat ng utos nasabi ni Jesus na... John 19:30 ..Natupad na ang misyon nya sa Lupa.>>>>>>> at mali naman talaga na ituring na tao LANG si Jesus.. andami talata sa biblia na nagpapatunay na sya ay TAGAPAGLIGTAS, PANGINOON, TAGAPAMAGITAN, PANGULO ng lahat ng NILALANG, bukod tangi na TAONG hindi nagkasala at marami pang iba.. pero yung GAWIN at ITURING na DIOS ay lalabag sa aral na nakasulat na IISA at TUNAY na DIOS na ang AMA lang gaya ng sinabi ni Jesus sa Juan 17: 1,3<<<<<<<


Ilang beses ko ba dapat ulitin na kaya nagkatawang tao ang Jesus ay para maging pantay ang tingin ng taong lupa sa kanya at sa gayon ay maramdaman nya ang sakit nang kagayang sa tao ay nararanasan? Kung sakaling kilala siyang anak ng Diyos, sa tingin nyo ba magkakaroon ng malalim na pag simpatya ang mga tayo sa kanyang kahabagan? Hindi...>>>>>>>> ang malinaw na nasa talata ay Verbo/Salita/Word/logos, wala pong Jesus na nabasa...kasi naging EXISTEDl ang ang Jesus NANG ipanganak ng isang BABAE at TAO ang likas na kalagayan... ang Verbo poh FYI ay " isang banaag na kaisipan na nagmumula sa Dios".. wala pa poh existing na jesus.. Verbo pa lang<<<<

Malinaw na sinabi sa video na MAY TANGI si Jesus na hindi mo makikita sa tao. So ano ang mga tanging iyon? Kung iyon ay katulad ng sa Diyos, maaari kaya nating isiping isa rin siyang "Diyos" ? In the sense of sinsabe sa video na may katangian sya, dahil ang pagkakaalam ko iisa lang ang katangian ng isang normal na tao. At pakiberipika ng link na nashare mo, mukhang mababaw lang ang pagunawa mo sa sitwasyon ni Thomas sa mga panahong iyon, pati ang ministro eh mababaw nilang dinigest kung papaano nila ipinaliwanag ang sitwasyon.

Malinaw si Thomas ay naniniwala kay Jesus subalit hindi nawala ang kanyang paniniwala na si Jesus ay isang "Diyos" ayon sa sumunod na talata. Subalit NAIS NYA LAMANG MAKASIGURO NA SI JESUS NGA ANG NABUHAY MULI. Just imagine wala si THomas noong unang magpakita si Jesus, pero alam ni Jesus ang kanyang agam agam. Yan dapat ang itatak mo sa iyong isipin. HIndi yung pang ibabaw na sinasabe lamang.

Hindi importante ang ibang salin kapatid. Kung susuriin mo ang pagkaka buod ng sentence, malalaman mo ang buong saloobin ng nagkwewkento. Hindi mo kailangan ng sinasabing "na shock" or ano pa man... Hayyysss...[/QUOTE]>>>>>>> Importante poh ang salin Sir.. kasi nahuhulog ang iba sa MALING pagkaunawa gaya ng nasa Juan 1:1 na iniisip ng iba na Dios (as in Noun) ang verbo samantalang INUURI lang na DIVINE or Banal dahil ang Dios ay banal gaya ni Kristo na banal din at ng mga ibang Tao na nabuhay ng BANAL pati ng mga anghel sa langit na BANAL din..<<<<<

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ang sabi mo poh ay
>>>Malinaw na sinabi sa video na MAY TANGI si Jesus na hindi mo makikita sa tao. So ano ang mga tanging iyon? Kung iyon ay katulad ng sa Diyos, maaari kaya nating isiping isa rin siyang "Diyos" ? In the sense of sinsabe sa video na may katangian sya, dahil ang pagkakaalam ko iisa lang ang katangian ng isang normal na tao.<<<

pwede sana yan kung payag ang Ama na pwedeng maging dios ang tao kaso ayaw nya gaya ng nababasa sa Oseas 11: 9 Hindi ko isasagawa ang kabangisan ng aking galit, hindi ako babalik upang ipahamak ang Ephraim: sapagka't ako'y Dios, at hindi tao; ang Banal sa gitna mo; at hindi ako paroroon na may galit.

at ang tao ay maging Dios naman ay hindi rin pinapayagan gaya nga nasusulat sa Ezekiel 28:2
“Anak ng tao, sabihin mo sa prinsipe sa Tiro, Ganito ang sabi ng Panginoong Dios: Sapagka't ang iyong puso ay nagmataas, at iyong sinabi, Ako'y dios, ako'y nauupo sa upuan ng Dios, sa gitna ng mga dagat; gayon man IKAW AY TAO, AT HINDI DIOS, bagaman iyong inilagak ang iyong puso na parang puso ng Dios;”


kung may malinaw lang sana na talata sa biblia na ipinakilala ni Cristo ang sarili nya na Dios eh wala sanang pagtatalo.. kaso ang pinakamalapit lang ay Juan 10:30 na ako at ang ama ay iisa... hindi malinaw kung ipinakilala nya na iisa sila ng Ama sa pagiging Dios..

pero sa katulad na talata na Juan 10:30 I and my Father are one in accord. GLT

ganyan poh kahalaga na alamin din ang ibang salin dahil parehas natin alam na ang unang Biblia ay malaon nang nawala at wala na ang mga orihinal na manuskrito.

Halimbawa na lang ay ang KJV na salin.. na 4rth level na pagkakasalin na based sa sinaunang manuskrito. at ang orihinal na wika ng biblia "Koene" ay WALANG PAGBABANTAS..
 
sabi sa ibang salin like Goodspeed ng katulad na talata ay

In the beginning the Word existed. The Word was with God, and the Word was DIVINE.

14 So the Word became flesh and blood and lived for a while among us, abounding in blessing and truth, and we saw the honor God had given him, such honor as an only son receives from his father.

sa salin naman ni James Mofatt ay ganito


1 THE Logos existed in the very beginning, the Logos was with God, the Logos was DIVINE.

14 So the Logos became flesh and tarried among us; we have seen his glory — glory such as an only son enjoys from his father — seen it to be full of grace and reality.

Ipinahihiwatig lang na ang Salita/Verbo/Word/Logos ay BANAL or DIVINE sa URI at hindi sa KALAGAYAN.... kung tatanggapin natin na lahat ng DIVINE ay Dios sa kalagayan ay dapat tanggapin mo din na si David, Abraham at Noe pati na rin si Esteban ay Dios din sa kalagayan kasi sila ay tinawag na mga BANAL.


Nope, wag mo guluhin ang iniikutan ng Trinity. We dont care about David and any... Dahil iyan ay likas na tao talaga.
Wag mo nang isalin pa sa ibang salin ang mga verses, nandyan na at malinaw, bakit doon pa sa malalim na salin mo ihuhugot lahat ng pagkakaiba nito? Sa ganyan bang paraan ba mo ginagawa para malinlang ang mga nagbabasa? Bakit pag malinaw sa verses na ayon sayo eh hindi na kailangan ng ibang salin?

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Hindi parin TAO lang.. Masasabi mo bang TAO lang si Jesus kung may espesyal na pagtatangi sa Kanya ang Ama? Hindi ko pinupush na isa Siyang Diyos ng kataastasan, ang punto ko eh hindi siya TAO mismo katulad ng TAO sa lupa. Sinabe ko na noong una pa, iyon ay MISYON ni Jesus sa Lupa. Di bat noong natupad na ang lahat ng utos nasabi ni Jesus na... John 19:30 ..Natupad na ang misyon nya sa Lupa.


Ilang beses ko ba dapat ulitin na kaya nagkatawang tao ang Jesus ay para maging pantay ang tingin ng taong lupa sa kanya at sa gayon ay maramdaman nya ang sakit nang kagayang sa tao ay nararanasan? Kung sakaling kilala siyang anak ng Diyos, sa tingin nyo ba magkakaroon ng malalim na pag simpatya ang mga tayo sa kanyang kahabagan? Hindi...

Malinaw na sinabi sa video na MAY TANGI si Jesus na hindi mo makikita sa tao. So ano ang mga tanging iyon? Kung iyon ay katulad ng sa Diyos, maaari kaya nating isiping isa rin siyang "Diyos" ? In the sense of sinsabe sa video na may katangian sya, dahil ang pagkakaalam ko iisa lang ang katangian ng isang normal na tao. At pakiberipika ng link na nashare mo, mukhang mababaw lang ang pagunawa mo sa sitwasyon ni Thomas sa mga panahong iyon, pati ang ministro eh mababaw nilang dinigest kung papaano nila ipinaliwanag ang sitwasyon.

Malinaw si Thomas ay naniniwala kay Jesus subalit hindi nawala ang kanyang paniniwala na si Jesus ay isang "Diyos" ayon sa sumunod na talata. Subalit NAIS NYA LAMANG MAKASIGURO NA SI JESUS NGA ANG NABUHAY MULI. Just imagine wala si THomas noong unang magpakita si Jesus, pero alam ni Jesus ang kanyang agam agam. Yan dapat ang itatak mo sa iyong isipin. HIndi yung pang ibabaw na sinasabe lamang.

Hindi importante ang ibang salin kapatid. Kung susuriin mo ang pagkaka buod ng sentence, malalaman mo ang buong saloobin ng nagkwewkento. Hindi mo kailangan ng sinasabing "na shock" or ano pa man... Hayyysss...[/QUOTE]

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ang pinag uusapan po natin dito kaibigan kung tao ba sya o Diyos,
tao po sya sa knyang katayuan ngunit sabi ko nga gnawa syang special ng AMA, gnawa syang tagapamagitan, tagapaglitas, at marami p bukod dun, ngunit malinaw na hindi sya Diyos spagkat iisa lamang ang Diyos na ipinakilala ni Jesus at walang iba kundi ang AMA lamang na syang lumikha sa lahat. Gaya ni Jesus na tao din namamatay at nasasaktan, Ang Panginoong Diyos po ay d po namamatay un po ang nkasulat si Bible. paglilinaw ko po kaibigan di ko po sinabing ordinaryong Tao sya, ang pinupunto ko po ay TAO pa rin sya ngunit di tulad ng ordinaryong tao.

Kung sasabihing si Jesus din po ay maaaring Diyos? magkakaproblema po tayo dun mismo sa sinabi ni JESUS na "AMA ikaw ang Tunay na iisang Diyos" or "only true God",

lalabas po na magiging dalawa po silang Diyos. Ang katangian ni Jesus ay nagmula sa Diyos AMA, pinagkalooban sya ng mga kakaibang Katangian na wala sa ordinaryong Tao. gaya dn ng mga Apostol nakagawa rin sila ng himala sapagkat un ay kaloob sa knina ng Diyos AMA.



tanong ko nman po sa inyo Kung hindi sya Tao o Diyos ano po sya para sa inyo?
 
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^Hanggang ngayon hindi mo naiintindihan point ko. Unang post ko palang pinapakita ko na hindi TAO si Jesus dahil parte sya ng Pagka Diyos ng Ama. Iyon ang hindi mo maintindihan. Lahat ng mga sinabe mo ay patungkol sa pagkakaroon ng relationship ng Anak sa Ama at Espirito Santo.

Again pantay pantay na ginawa ng Ama ang tao, walang espesyal na katulad ng sinasabe mo. NAGKATAWANG TAO si Jesus hindi TAO. Meaning nang nagkatawang TAO, may pagkakakilanlan na Siya noon pa man at iyon ay HINDI TAO. Mahirap bang indintidhin yon? Magkaiba ang punto ng nagkatawang TAO sa talagang TAO. Intindihin mo basic lang yan.

Again technically Yes kung titignan mong "Diyos" sya. Dahil parte sya ng Ama. Parang ganito lang yan, Ulo, Kamay, Paa, pero nagmumula sa isang tao. Sana nagegets mo na.

Again balikan mo ang Juan 1:1 at Juan 1:14. Malinaw naman kung ano si Jesus. Hindi mo na kailangang paikutin ang mga salin,
 
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^Hanggang ngayon hindi mo naiintindihan point ko. Unang post ko palang pinapakita ko na hindi TAO si Jesus dahil parte sya ng Pagka Diyos ng Ama. Iyon ang hindi mo maintindihan. Lahat ng mga sinabe mo ay patungkol sa pagkakaroon ng relationship ng Anak sa Ama at Espirito Santo.

Again pantay pantay na ginawa ng Ama ang tao, walang espesyal na katulad ng sinasabe mo. NAGKATAWANG TAO si Jesus hindi TAO. Meaning nang nagkatawang TAO, may pagkakakilanlan na Siya noon pa man at iyon ay HINDI TAO. Mahirap bang indintidhin yon? Magkaiba ang punto ng nagkatawang TAO sa talagang TAO. Intindihin mo basic lang yan.

Again technically Yes kung titignan mong "Diyos" sya. Dahil parte sya ng Ama. Parang ganito lang yan, Ulo, Kamay, Paa, pero nagmumula sa isang tao. Sana nagegets mo na.

Again balikan mo ang Juan 1:1 at Juan 1:14. Malinaw naman kung ano si Jesus. Hindi mo na kailangang paikutin ang mga salin,

Mawalang galang na po. Paulit ulit nang pinapaliwanag sa iyo ang nasa Juan 1:1 at 14. Ang kahulugan po ng Verbo ay hindi Cristo na may kalagayan na kundi Cristo na nasa Isip ng Ama o plano ng Ama.
Kung may salin ka ng Biblia na "BAGONG TIPANG KATOLIKO" mababasa mo sa footnote na inilagay ng pari na si Juan Trinidad yung kahulugan ng Verbo. Mas matalino ka pa ba sa pari niyo? Salusalungat pala pari niyo? Di nagkakaisa ng paniniwala?
Para madaling maunawaan parang ganito lang ang Verbo.

Halimbawa may plano ka o nasa isip kang gagawin mo, gusto mong kumain mamaya. Kung tatanungin ko ngayon kalimbawa. Nakakain ka na ba? Ang sagot mo "hindi pa" pero yung gagawin mong kakain ka nasa isip mo na. E kailan mo lang masasabing nakakain ka na? Edi kapag kumain ka na. Ang NAGKATAWANG TAO ay yung plano ng Diyos, ibig lang sabihin ay natupad ang Verbo o Plano ng Diyos.

Nagexist lang ang Cristo nang ipanganak na siya ni Maria.
The fact din na si Cristo ay ipinanganak ang nagpapatotoo na hindi siya diyos. Dahil ang tunay na Diyos ay hindi ipinapanganak (Bilang 23:19)

Maraming Katangian si Cristo na wala sa karaniwang tao. Wala tayong pagtatalo diyan. Pero hindi batayan yan para paniwalaan mong diyos siya.

Isaias 45:21 ang Diyos ay isang GANAP na Diyos ayon mismo sa kaniyang ipinahayag. Genesis 35:11 siya rin ang nagpatotoo na siya ay Makapangyarihan kaya bakit ipinagpipilitan niyo na may kapersona siya?
 
^ Sinagot mo na rin ang katanungan mo, na hindi talaga TAO si Jesus, ngunit isang plano ng Ama. Samakatwid, hindi natural na naging TAO si Jesus. Pero ang paratang nyo ay taong natural katulad ng ibang taong pinanganak. Tama ba o Mali? Ngayon kung sasabihin mong TAO parin syang natural, eh bakit may pagtatanging espesyal para kay Jesus? Di ba nga't pantay pantay tayong nilikha ng Ama? Ang punto ko ay hindi mismo si Jesus ang supreme na Diyos, bagkus ay parte sya ng Ama sa lahat ng Kanyang plano. Hindi mo pwedeng sabihing TAO lang si Jesus gayong may authority sya na hindi mo makikita sa tao. Mas mainam na sabihing NAGKATAWANG TAO si Jesus instead of saying na TAO sya.

Ngayon tatanungin kita. TAONG NATURAL BA SI JESUS o NAGKATAWANG TAO?

At kung si Jesus at ang Espiritu Santo ay galing sa Diyos. Maaari mo bang sabihing IBA pa iyon sa AMA? O masasabi nating sila ay IISA dahil sa AMA sila lahat nanggaling? Ang ginagawa ba ni Jesus ay taliwas sa gustong mangyari ng AMA? Ang mga ginagawa ba ng Holy Spirit ay taliwas sa gustong mangyari ng Ama? O masasabi nating itong tatlong ito ay IISA?
 
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^ Sinagot mo na rin ang katanungan mo, na hindi talaga TAO si Jesus, ngunit isang plano ng Ama. Samakatwid, hindi natural na naging TAO si Jesus. Pero ang paratang nyo ay taong natural katulad ng ibang taong pinanganak. Tama ba o Mali? Ngayon kung sasabihin mong TAO parin syang natural, eh bakit may pagtatanging espesyal para kay Jesus? Di ba nga't pantay pantay tayong nilikha ng Ama? Ang punto ko ay hindi mismo si Jesus ang supreme na Diyos, bagkus ay parte sya ng Ama sa lahat ng Kanyang plano. Hindi mo pwedeng sabihing TAO lang si Jesus gayong may authority sya na hindi mo makikita sa tao. Mas mainam na sabihing NAGKATAWANG TAO si Jesus instead of saying na TAO sya.

Ngayon tatanungin kita. TAONG NATURAL BA SI JESUS o NAGKATAWANG TAO?

At kung si Jesus at ang Espiritu Santo ay galing sa Diyos. Maaari mo bang sabihing IBA pa iyon sa AMA? O masasabi nating sila ay IISA dahil sa AMA sila lahat nanggaling? Ang ginagawa ba ni Jesus ay taliwas sa gustong mangyari ng AMA? Ang mga ginagawa ba ng Holy Spirit ay taliwas sa gustong mangyari ng Ama? O masasabi nating itong tatlong ito ay IISA?

Haynako. Hirap mong paliwanagan brad, ano kaya pagkaintindi mo sa Natural? Nagkatawang Tao tapos hindi Tao? Pati ako nabobobo sa iyo e.

Kung magbigay ako sa iyo ng mga may pahayag sa Biblia na may iba pa na nanggaling sa Ama tatanggapin mo bang Diyos din sila? Ikaw ba hindi ka ba galing sa Ama? Hindi ba't nilalang ka Niya? O baka naniniwala ka sa Ebulosyon na Unggoy ka?

Nakakabobo ng mga arguments mo na puro lang naman galing sa Opinion mo.

Kung opinion lang pala labanan dito e walang katapusang argument yan. Kasi dami mong naiiisip na kabalbalan. LOL
 
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Ang napakahalagang tanong. SAAN PO SILA IISA?

SA PAGIGING DIYOS PO BA?

Nagtatanong lang naman po. Hihihi.

Parang kakainin mo pa sinabi mo.

"Ang problema kasi sa ating mga tao, ipinipilit natin pag hindi na abot ng ating pang unawa ang sinasabi ng Bibliya, igigiit pa natin ang ating sariling interpretasyon kahit mali."

Hindi ba parang binibigyan mo ng interpretasyon yang IISA na nakalagay. Kailan naging ISA lang ang TATLO? HAHAHA.

INUULIT KO PO PAKISAGOT. SAAN SILA IISA? SA PAGIGING DIYOS BA GAYA NG INTERPRETASYON MO?

Pwede pong sumagot? Para mas maintindihan natin ang pakahulugan ng "I and my father are One" suriin muna natin ang contexto o yung buong talata o chapter ng verse na ito.

Rejecting the Claims of Christ
(John 10:22–42)
At that time the Feast of the Dedication took place at Jerusalem; it was winter, and Jesus was walking in the temple in the portico of Solomon. The Jews then gathered around Him, and were saying to Him, “How long will You keep us in suspense? If You are the Christ, tell us plainly.” Jesus answered them, “I told you, and you do not believe; the works that I do in My Father’s name, these testify of Me. But you do not believe because you are not of My sheep. My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me; and I give eternal life to them, and they will never perish; and no one will snatch them out of My hand. My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand. I and the Father are one.” The Jews picked up stones again to stone Him. Jesus answered them, “I showed you many good works from the Father; for which of them are you stoning Me?” The Jews answered Him, “For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God.” Jesus answered them, “Has it not been written in your Law, ‘I said, you are gods’? If he called them gods, to whom the word of God came (and the Scripture cannot be broken), do you say of Him, whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world, ‘You are blaspheming,’ because I said, ‘I am the Son of God’? If I do not do the works of My Father, do not believe Me; but if I do them, though you do not believe Me, believe the works, so that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I in the Father.” Therefore they were seeking again to seize Him, and He eluded their grasp. And He went away again beyond the Jordan to the place where John was first baptizing, and He was staying there. Many came to Him and were saying, “While John performed no sign, yet everything John said about this man was true.” Many believed in Him there. (10:22–42)
This passage marks the end of John’s presentation of Christ’s public ministry. For more than three years, Jesus had traveled the length and breadth of Israel, preaching the gospel, calling for repentance, confronting hypocritical false religion, instructing His disciples, and performing countless signs and wonders, which confirmed that He was the Messiah. Through both His words and His works, Jesus had clearly demonstrated His deity and equality with God.
But tragically the nation of Israel, led by her religious leaders, rejected the Messiah—just as the Old Testament predicted would happen (cf. Ps. 22:6–8; Isa. 49:7; 50:6; 53:3). At the end of His life, Jesus had a mere handful of genuine followers; the Bible mentions 120 in Jerusalem (Acts 1:15), and several hundred more, probably in Galilee (1 Cor. 15:6; cf. Matt. 28:7, 16). Instead of embracing Him as their long-awaited Redeemer King, the people of Israel “nailed [Him] to a cross by the hands of godless men and put Him to death” (Acts 2:23). As noted in previous chapters of this volume, the nation’s rejection of Jesus is a frequent theme in John’s gospel (cf. 1:10–11; 3:32; 4:1–3; 5:16–18; 6:41–43, 66; 7:1, 20, 26–27, 30–52; 8:13–59; 9:16, 24, 29, 40–41; 10:20; 11:46–57; 12:37–40).
In keeping with that theme, in the concluding section of chapter 10 John punctuates the long presentation of our Lord’s public ministry (which began in 1:35) with yet another confrontation between Jesus and the Jewish religious leaders. The dialogue between them unfolds in five scenes: the confrontation, the claim, the charge, the challenge, and the consequences.
THE CONFRONTATION
At that time the Feast of the Dedication took place at Jerusalem; it was winter, and Jesus was walking in the temple in the portico of Solomon. The Jews then gathered around Him, and were saying to Him, “How long will You keep us in suspense? If You are the Christ, tell us plainly.” (10:22–24)
John’s note that it was now the time of the Feast of the Dedication sets the stage for the next episode. There is a gap of approximately two months between verse 21 (which is still set at the time of the Feast of Tabernacles [7:2, 10, 37]) and verse 22. Some commentators think that Jesus left Jerusalem during that two-month period, since verse 22 calls attention to Jerusalem again as the setting for this dialogue. Others believe the Lord remained in the vicinity of Jerusalem, since verse 22 does not say that He went up to Jerusalem—the usual wording for going to the city from another region (cf. 2:13; 5:1; 11:55; Matt. 20:17–18; Luke 2:22; 19:28; Acts 11:2; 15:2; 21:12, 15; 24:11; 25:1, 9; Gal. 1:17–18). Both views are only speculative, since the gospels do not say where Jesus was during those two months.
Known today as Hanukkah, or the Feast of Lights (because of the lamps and candles lit in Jewish homes as part of the celebration), the Feast of the Dedication was celebrated on the twenty-fifth day of the Jewish month Chislev (Nov.–Dec). It was not one of the feasts prescribed in the Old Testament, but originated during the intertestamental period. The feast commemorated the Israelites’ victory over the infamous Syrian king Antiochus Epiphanes (175–164 B.C.). A devotee of Greek culture, Antiochus, in a decree given by him in 167 B.C., sought to impose it on his subjects (a process known as Hellenization). Antiochus captured Jerusalem and desecrated the temple (170 B.C.) by sacrificing a pig on the altar, setting up a pagan altar in its place, and erecting a statue of Zeus in the most holy place. As he attempted to systematically stamp out Judaism, Antiochus brutally oppressed the Jews, who clung tenaciously to their religion. Under his despotic direction, the Jews were required to offer sacrifices to pagan gods; they were not allowed to own or read the Old Testament Scriptures, and copies of it were destroyed; and they were forbidden to perform such mandatory religious practices as observing the Sabbath and circumcising children. Antiochus was the first pagan king to persecute the Jews for their religion (cf. Dan. 8:9–14, 23–25; 11:21–35).
Antiochus’ savage persecution caused the pious Jews to rise in revolt, led by a priest named Mattathias and his sons. After three years of guerilla warfare the Jews, under the brilliant military leadership of Judas Maccabeus (the son of Mattathias), were able to retake Jerusalem. On 25 Chislev 164 B.C., they liberated the temple, rededicated it, and established the Feast of Dedication. The apocryphal book of 2 Maccabees recounts an historical version of the story:
Now Maccabeus and his followers, the Lord leading them on, recovered the temple and the city; and they tore down the altars which had been built in the public square by the foreigners, and also destroyed the sacred precincts. They purified the sanctuary, and made another altar of sacrifice; then, striking fire out of flint, they offered sacrifices, after a lapse of two years, and they burned incense and lighted lamps and set out the bread of the Presence. And when they had done this, they fell prostrate and besought the Lord that they might never again fall into such misfortunes, but that, if they should ever sin, they might be disciplined by him with forbearance and not be handed over to blasphemous and barbarous nations. It happened that on the same day on which the sanctuary had been profaned by the foreigners, the purification of the sanctuary took place, that is, on the twenty-fifth day of the same month, which was Chislev And they celebrated it for eight days with rejoicing, in the manner of the feast of booths, remembering how not long before, during the feast of booths, they had been wandering in the mountains and caves like wild animals. Therefore bearing ivy-wreathed wands and beautiful branches and also fronds of palm, they offered hymns of thanksgiving to him who had given success to the purifying of his own holy place. They decreed by public ordinance and vote that the whole nation of the Jews should observe these days every year. (10:1–8)
The Feast of Dedication, which celebrated the successful revolt, took place in winter, which may explain why Jesus, who was walking in the temple, was specifically in the portico of Solomon. It was probably cold, and may have been raining, since winter is the rainy season in Palestine. The portico of Solomon would have provided a measure of protection from the elements; it was a roofed colonnade supported by pillars, located on the east side of the temple area and overlooking the Kidron Valley below. Many people frequented the site, especially in inclement weather. Some walked there to meditate, and rabbis sometimes taught their students there. Later, the early Christians would gather in the portico of Solomon to proclaim the gospel (Acts 3:11;5:12).
Some see in John’s reference to winter a metaphor for the Jews’ spiritual state—that it described not only the season of the year, but also Israel’s spiritual coldness. “The thoughtful reader of the Gospel understands that time and temperature notations in John are reflections of the spiritual condition of the persons in the stories (cf. 3:2; 13:30; 18:18; 20:1, 19; 21:3–4)” (Gerald L. Borchert, John 1–11, The New American Commentary [Nashville: Broadman & Holman, 2002], 337–38).
The hostile Jews accosted the Lord (the verb weakly translated gathered around literally means “to surround,” or “to encircle” [cf. Luke 21:20; Acts 14:20; Heb. 11:30]) and demanded of Him, “How long will You keep us in suspense? If You are the Christ, tell us plainly.” By asking Jesus if He was the Messiah, the Jewish leaders were certainly asking the right question; indeed, it is the most significant question anyone can ask (cf. Matt. 16:15–16). But given the revelation they had seen and heard, and their hostility to Jesus over the course of that revelation, their motive was suspect. Far from being an honest request for information, their inquiry was actually just another attempt to trap Jesus with a view to getting rid of Him. Because He was the greatest threat to their power and prestige, they were desperately looking for a way to discredit Him and dispose of Him altogether. They were unsettled by the miraculous signs He performed (11:47); tired of the divisions He caused (Luke 12:51–53), even within their own ranks (cf. 9:16); fearful of the revolt He might spark against Rome, which would jeopardize their privileged political status (11:48); angered by His public rebuke of their hypocrisy (e.g., Matt. 23:1–36); and, most of all, outraged by His unapologetic claim to be God (5:18; 10:33; 19:7). The Jewish authorities’ strategy was to make Him declare publicly (the verb translated plainly can also be translated “publicly,” or “openly” [7:4, 13, 26; 11:54; 18:20]) that He was the Messiah, so that they would have a pretext for arresting Him.
THE CLAIM
Jesus answered them, “I told you, and you do not believe; the works that I do in My Father’s name, these testify of Me. But you do not believe because you are not of My sheep. My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me; and I give eternal life to them, and they will never perish; and no one will snatch them out of My hand. My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand. I and the Father are one.” The Jews picked up stones again to stone Him. (10:25–31)
But Jesus already had told them plainly who He was (cf. 5:17ff.; 8:12, 24, 58); in fact, He had spent the last three years doing so. Not only that, the works that He did in the Father’s name also demonstrated that He was the Messiah; the Son of God; God in human flesh (cf. vv. 32, 38; 3:2; 5:36; 7:31; 11:47; 14:11; Acts 2:22). The Lord’s twice-repeated declaration, you do not believe, indicates that the problem was not due to any ambiguity in the revelation of the truth, but rather to their spiritual blindness. They lacked understanding, not because they lacked information, but because they lacked repentance and faith. Their unbelief was not due to insufficient exposure to the truth, but to their hatred of the truth and love of sin and lies (John 3:19–21). Anyone who willingly seeks the truth will find it (7:17), but Jesus refused to commit Himself to those who willfully rejected the truth. Had He again given them the plain answer they were demanding, they would not have believed Him anyway (cf. 8:43; Matt. 26:63–65; Luke 22:66–67).
From the perspective of human responsibility, the hostile Jews did not believe because they had deliberately rejected the truth. But from the standpoint of divine sovereignty, they did not believe because they were not of the Lord’s sheep, which were given Him by the Father (v. 29; 6:37; 17:2, 6, 9). A full understanding of exactly how those two realities, human responsibility and divine sovereignty, work together lies beyond human comprehension; but there is no difficulty with them in the infinite mind of God. Significantly, the Bible does not attempt to harmonize them, nor does it apologize for the logical tension between them. For example, speaking of Judas Iscariot’s treachery, Jesus said in Luke 22:22, “The Son of Man is going [to be betrayed] as it has been determined.” In other words, Judas’s betrayal of Christ was in accord with God’s eternal purpose. But then Jesus added, “Woe to that man by whom He is betrayed!” That Judas’s betrayal was part of God’s plan did not relieve him of the responsibility for his crime. In Acts 2:23 Peter said that Jesus was “delivered over [to the cross] by the predetermined plan and foreknowledge of God.” Yet he also charged Israel with responsibility for having “nailed [Jesus] to a cross by the hands of godless men and put Him to death.” God’s sovereignty never excuses human sin. (For a more complete discussion of the interplay of divine sovereignty and human responsibility, see the exposition of 6:35–40 in chapter 20 of this volume.)
Repeating what He said in His discourse on the Good Shepherd (see the exposition of vv. 3–5 in the previous chapter of this volume), Jesus said, “My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me.” The elect will heed Christ’s call to salvation and continue in faith and obedience to eternal glory (cf. Rom. 8:29–30).
The Lord continued by articulating the wonderful truth that those who are His sheep need never fear being lost. “I give eternal life to them,” Jesus declared, “and they will never perish; and no one will snatch them out of My hand. My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand.” Nowhere in Scripture is there a stronger affirmation of the absolute eternal security of all true Christians. Jesus plainly taught that the security of the believer in salvation does not depend on human effort, but is grounded in the gracious, sovereign election, promise, and power of God.
Christ’s words reveal seven realities that bind every true Christian forever to God. First, believers are His sheep, and it is the duty of the Good Shepherd to protect His flock.”This is the will of Him who sent Me,” Jesus said, “that of all that He has given Me I lose nothing, but raise it up on the last day” (6:39). To insist that a true Christian can somehow be lost is to deny the truth of that statement. It is also to defame the character of the Lord Jesus Christ—making Him out to be an incompetent shepherd, unable to hold on to those entrusted to Him by the Father.
Second, Christ’s sheep hear only His voice and follow only Him. Since they will not listen to or follow a stranger (10:5), they could not possibly wander away from Him and be eternally lost.
Third, Christ’s sheep have eternal life. To speak of eternal life ending is a contradiction in terms.
Fourth, Christ gives eternal life to His sheep. Since they did nothing to earn it, they can do nothing to lose it.
Fifth, Christ promised that His sheep will never perish. Were even one to do so, it would make Him a liar.
Sixth, no one—not false shepherds (the thieves and robbers of v. 1), or false prophets (symbolized by the wolf of v. 12), nor even the Devil himself—is powerful enough to snatch Christ’s sheep out of His hand.
Finally, Christ’s sheep are held not only in His hand, but also in the hand of the Father, who is greater than all; and thus no one is able to snatch them out of His hand either. Infinitely secure, the believer’s “life is hidden with Christ in God” (Col. 3:3).
The Father and the Son jointly guarantee the eternal security of believers because, as Jesus declared, “I and the Father are one” (the Greek word one is neuter, not masculine; it speaks of “one substance,” not “one person”). Thus their unity of purpose and action in safeguarding believers is undergirded by their unity of nature and essence. The whole matter of security is summarized in our Lord’s own words in John 6:39–40:
This is the will of Him who sent Me, that of all that He has given Me I lose nothing, but raise it up on the last day. For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who beholds the Son and believes in Him will have eternal life, and I Myself will raise him up on the last day.
Incensed by what they accurately and unmistakably perceived as another blasphemous claim to deity by Jesus, the Jews, self-righ-teously exploding in a fit of passion, picked up stones again to stone Him—the fourth time in John’s gospel that they had attempted to kill Him (5:16–18; 7:1; 8:59). Though the Romans had withheld the right of capital punishment from the Jews (18:31), this angry lynch mob was ready to take matters into its own hands.

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In short
10:30 I and My Father are one. Both Father and Son are committed to the perfect protection and preservation of Jesus’ sheep. The sentence, emphasizing the united purpose and action of both in the security and safety of the flock, presupposes unity of nature and essence (see 5:17–23; 17:22).

John 5:17-23 English Standard Version (ESV)

17 But Jesus answered them, “My Father is working until now, and I am working.”

Jesus Is Equal with God
18 This was why the Jews were seeking all the more to kill him, because not only was he breaking the Sabbath, but he was even calling God his own Father, making himself equal with God.

The Authority of the Son
19 So Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, the Son can do nothing of his own accord, but only what he sees the Father doing. For whatever the Father[a] does, that the Son does likewise. 20 For the Father loves the Son and shows him all that he himself is doing. And greater works than these will he show him, so that you may marvel. 21 For as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, so also the Son gives life to whom he will. 22 For the Father judges no one, but has given all judgment to the Son, 23 that all may honor the Son, just as they honor the Father. Whoever does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent him.

5:17 Jesus’ point is that whether He broke the Sabbath or not, God was working continuously and, since Jesus Himself worked continuously, He also must be God. Furthermore, God does not need a day of rest for He never wearies (Is. 40:28). For Jesus’ self-defense to be valid, the same factors that apply to God must also apply to Him. Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath (Matt. 12:8)! Interestingly, even the rabbis admitted that God’s work had not ceased after the Sabbath because He sustains the universe.
5:18 This verse confirms that the Jews instantly grasped the implications of His remarks that He was God (see note on v. 17 ).
5:19 Most assuredly. Cf. verses 24, 25; 1:51. This is an emphatic way of saying “I’m telling you the truth.” In response to Jewish hostility at the implications of His assertions of equality with God, Jesus became even more fearless, forceful, and emphatic. Jesus essentially tied His activities of healing on the Sabbath directly to the Father. The Son never took independent action that set Him against the Father because the Son only did those things that were coincident with and coextensive with all that the Father does. Jesus thus implied that the only One who could do what the Father does must be as great as the Father.
5:20 greater works. This refers to the powerful work of raising the dead. God has that power (cf. 1 Kin. 17:17–24; 2 Kin. 4:32–37; 5:7) and so does the Lord Jesus (vv. 21–29; 11:25–44; 14:19; 20:1–18).
5:23 honor the Son. This verse gives the reason that God entrusted all judgment to the Son (v. 22), i.e., so that all men should honor the Son just as they honor the Father. This verse goes far beyond making Jesus a mere ambassador who is acting in the name of a monarch, but gives Him full and complete equality with the Father (cf. Phil. 2:9–11). honor the Father. Jesus turned the tables on the Jewish accusation against Him of blasphemy. Instead, Jesus affirmed that the only way anyone can honor the Father is through receiving the Son. Therefore, the Jews were the ones who actually blasphemed the Father by rejection of His Son.
 
@ern

Okay lang yan kung hindi mo maunawaan ang pagkakaiba ng NATURAL NA TAO sa NAGKATAWANG TAO.
Baka hindi mo rin alam ang 100% sa 50% sa 25% sa 0% ang pagkakaiba?

Hindi ako galing sa AMA.. Galing ako sa lahi ni Eba’t Adan. Magkaiba ang direkatang nanggaling sa may pinanggalingan. Gets mo ba? Or
Medyo mahina pumick-up? To make it short hindi direktang ginawa ako ng Ama, hindi katulad ni Jesus na sya mismo ang nagbigay. Okay ka na?

Hahayaan ko na ang payak mong kaisipan na hanggang dyan na lang ang kakayahan mong unawain. Maaari ko na rin siguro sabihing walang pagkaka-ISA ang KARAMIHAN sainyo.
 
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Sagot Hindi

Kasi U
Kung Diyos Talaga Sya Bat Cxa Pa ang tumolong sa mga tao pwede aman na ung mga Propheta nya o mga sugo nya..
Para skin Isa syang Propheta Lang Hindi Diyos...:lol::lol:

Actually ginawa na Niya noong una pa. At dahil ayaw makinig sa mga propeta Niya at pinagpapatay pa ng mga Propeta NIya, Siya mismo ang kumilos.
 
ang tanong meron bang taong kayang mabuhay muli??

Meron poh..

1.Yung anak ng babaing balo na BINUHAY muli ni Elias
2. Yung anak na babae ni Jairo na binuhay ni Jesus
3. Lazaro na binuhay ni Jesus
4. Dorcas na binuhay ni Pedro
5. Eutico na binuhay ni Pablo
6. Jesus na binuhay ng Dios

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@ern

Okay lang yan kung hindi mo maunawaan ang pagkakaiba ng NATURAL NA TAO sa NAGKATAWANG TAO.
Baka hindi mo rin alam ang 100% sa 50% sa 25% sa 0% ang pagkakaiba?

Hindi ako galing sa AMA.. Galing ako sa lahi ni Eba’t Adan. Magkaiba ang direkatang nanggaling sa may pinanggalingan. Gets mo ba? Or
Medyo mahina pumick-up? To make it short hindi direktang ginawa ako ng Ama, hindi katulad ni Jesus na sya mismo ang nagbigay. Okay ka na?

Hahayaan ko na ang payak mong kaisipan na hanggang dyan na lang ang kakayahan mong unawain. Maaari ko na rin siguro sabihing walang pagkaka-ISA ang KARAMIHAN sainyo.

Eh paano kung mababasa sa Biblia na si Jesus ay galing or mula din sa lahi ni Adan at Eba? tatanggapin mo na Tao talaga si Jesus? TAO ha at hindi Tao LANG..
 
Sa mga hindi naniniwala dyan. Hindi rin po ba kayo naniniwala sa Holy trinity?
 
Meron poh..

1.Yung anak ng babaing balo na BINUHAY muli ni Elias
2. Yung anak na babae ni Jairo na binuhay ni Jesus
3. Lazaro na binuhay ni Jesus
4. Dorcas na binuhay ni Pedro
5. Eutico na binuhay ni Pablo
6. Jesus na binuhay ng Dios

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Eh paano kung mababasa sa Biblia na si Jesus ay galing or mula din sa lahi ni Adan at Eba? tatanggapin mo na Tao talaga si Jesus? TAO ha at hindi Tao LANG..

Wag mo na paikutin. Nandon na ang punto eh. Iikot mo na naman ang storya hanggang sa mabali. Paano manggagaling sa lahi ni Eba at Adan eh direkta syang plinano ng Ama at inilagay sa sinapupunan ni Maria. Uulitin ko ulet, NAGKATAWANG TAO.
 
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